www.zgeist.eu

So, I noticed that the existing leaderboard shows scores and all other data of every player ever played at ZG and has been saving changes in this data from ever since that leaderboard was created. Its fine, it shows about everything one would like to know about any player. But the problem is that the players who have been playing from a really long time, are securing the top ranks. And just stating facts here, I have played with many players above my rank and many of these players weren't very good against me. and I do earn points, of course, that's not the issue... The issue, however, is that since they have been playing for such a long time, it is going to take me quite a long time to get a better rank than them. Now while I like to play hl2dm for fun, there is a part of me that wants to be competitive. So, I could bear with this at some point but here comes this another issue: sometimes a player plays against me, he plays quite scarcely at ZG but has a skillset nearly equal to or greater than my own skillset. So, even though I manage to win the match, I lose points in BIG amounts and that is because I believe they are of a rank lower than mine. So, rank is OK but that doesn't precisely tell a player's skillset and winning the match doesn't always mean that one gains points.
AND another irritating issue is that some of these high rankers don't play at ZG a lot of time. Wy do they have to? is the question that comes in mind. Well, how am I going to then find out who is better (me or them) and in accordance to the existing methods of point evaluation, I can only rank up faster if I can fight them (resulting in increase of my points and decrease of their points if I manage to play better than them). But that can only happen if they Play frequently.

So all that being said, I would like to provide a suggestion to add another leaderboard (say LB2) alongside the existing leaderboard. However, LB2's data will be refreshed on a regular interval basis, be it once in a week, once in a month... doesn't matter. What matters is that the leaderboard has to be refreshed because I would really like to see myself in rank 1 sometime in at least some leaderboard. and that won't (can't) happen in the existing leaderboard but there is a possibility for it to happen in LB2.
and I guess the method for evaluating points and showing them for LB2 need to be different. But I don't really see that as a issue for me. I would just love to have LB2 in ZG

So that would also be a request of mine to the admins. Please look into it! I already love ZG a lot and this addition of LB2 will literally make me want to play more at ZG.

I already thought about this and how leaderboard is a bit bad but the problem is, even with a weekly or monthly leaderboard, who plays more time will have more points. Exist a lot of factors that I think makes the LB bs, but your idea could be interesting.

Boria Blyat wrote:I already thought about this and how leaderboard is a bit bad but the problem is, even with a weekly or monthly leaderboard, who plays more time will have more points. Exist a lot of factors that I think makes the LB bs, but your idea could be interesting.

If its feasible to have 2 LBs then why not ))
the main LB remains as it is and the refreshing LB will give others the opportunity and the experience of being rank 1. at least I would like to see myself resting at rank 1 for once

edit: ofcourse the one who plays more, has more points. but if one were to look at the, lets say top 10 positions, reaching that many points means I have to play about 15 hours against players everyday, not to mention I have to play better everytime and maybe I can reach those many points after 4-5 months or so. But that in my case is impossible :') I can barely play for 45 minutes on a stretch. which means my dream to someday get to top 10 if not top 1, remains a dream forever

another edit: I realized that introducing a refreshing LB can actually make other players to play more at ZG too. I mean if people are told that they can be this week's or this month's best player, why would they not want to be?

You overestimate the amount of points gained from killing high ranked players. The only meaningful method of ranking up is by getting kill streaks.

Also, we do have 2 leaderboards:
https://www.zgeist.eu/ranksmain.html
https://www.zgeist.eu/ranksmatch.html

[ZG] abracadabra wrote:You overestimate the amount of points gained from killing high ranked players. The only meaningful method of ranking up is by getting kill streaks.

Also, we do have 2 leaderboards:
https://www.zgeist.eu/ranksmain.html
https://www.zgeist.eu/ranksmatch.html

Ok I believe there is a misunderstanding here. I said that I can only 'rank up' faster if I first, get to play against high rankers and second, play better than them. What I meant to refer here is that this will result in a good gain of my points and reduction of their points, and this will give me improvement on the table while they will have the opposite of it (a not-so significant amount, but just explaining myself here). I never said that I could gain MASSIVE amounts of points this way.
I completely agree with you about the meaningful method of ranking up by getting kill streaks. I myself have earned a maximum of about 35,000 points in a single match 'cause of kill streaks. But now consider this: a not so regular player of ZG joins, they have a rank waaay lower than mine, but have a skillset of a professional. So the first problem I see is that even if I get a good streak, unless I'm postal or sensei my kills don't really bear me points (I'm afraid I noticed getting +2 points for every kill while I was neither the postal nor the sensei). AND almost everytime they manage to break my streak before I reach postal (please don't ask me how that happens 'cause that even includes issues from my side, eg: high ping, but I can't really complain about that). So, for everytime I am killed by them I lose for about 200 points.

Now I foresee another question coming that might be close to- "Why not play more with players in the rank range close to mine ?". As a matter of fact, I love ZG, period. I would love to play with anyone who joins the server. But I also like to invite my friends to play there. And these friends of mine are no newbies, they are very, very good players. and as they are my friends, I naturally enjoy playing with them. And sometimes I even manage to win the match. But then I am shown that I have lost (say)560 points while I won with a score of (say)17-7 just because they are completely new to ZG and they have the lowest ranks. And watching those loss points quickly steals away the joy of victory in the match.

So now what am I supposed to do? I can't just camp and kill that's not my style. And I would not stop inviting friends over to ZG just because I could lose points.
I do know that we already have 2 LBs. I would firstly like to apologise for not being clear about where I was suggesting another LB. But now I am clearly stating that I would like to have another LB alongside the existing LB of the ZG Main Server.

One may ask me- "Why not try to secure a top rank at the ZG match LB?" Well, I would just like to secure the same in the main server. That would be answer to this question (if it is ever asked, ofcourse). There are a lot of things I want to say along with that answer, but I'm afraid it'll go out of context.

I also thought about that and Im going to say this, if you are going to play for leaderboard, you wont have as much fun as you should have.
In leaderboard exist a lot of things and factors that can change your earn of points.

The Leaderboard of ZG dont reflect your skill

Look at this example, if a new person kills me with crossbar is -600. If I play for the leaderboard, or I leave or I tryhard and that player would leave and you didnt get your lost points, do you think that is worthy? Do you think playing with Leaderboard is worthy? For me no.

If you want to test your skill and wanna be competitive, look at the scoreboard.
Your idea of two leaderboards is interesting but you need to understand that making this required time and effort. If you really want this, you need to give really good arguments of why adding this would be worthy.

I have already stated all of my arguments. I would just like to know the final decision.

Ok, so the way I see this is:
1. There are a few way to get up the ranks rather quickly. Zen managed to get over me in the space of 3 months, starting from 0
This is possible thanks to the system of newer players make more point when they start, it give them a chance to get high if they work hard at it.
As abra pointed out, one example of getting up high on the scoreboard is killstreaks. Perhaps another way is to watchout for noobs, or use the right weapons or avoid being killed by certain weapons.
You can look at ratio there https://www.zgeist.eu/guidemain.html
There are many possibilities.
This makes for a very interesting scoreboard IMO, which does show a player ability to play (you have to have skills to make it up there) but also a player's ability to think strategically and "exploit" that system to get up.
I remember when Timmy joined, I used to lose between 2000 and 5000 points per round. But that is by design, I did not go all the way down the scoreboard because of that either.
I did however run away from his crowbar as much as possible lol
Another example is to make 250 points every day, just by being the 1st player to join.

2. If you want to look at who is stronger on 1v1 etc, the place to do so is in the MATCH server, there all the results are reported and you can see the winners.
https://www.zgeist.eu/match.html

My conclusion:
Perhaps the way to go is to reset the MATCH server ranks more often?

Another thought. IT would be possible to integrate a system like consortium to ZG if that is what you wish, but that will include a lot of database work.
But I am always open to make changes / add stuff if everyone wants it.

replying to your conclusions after looking at your pov:
I do not wish for the MATCH server LB to refresh

so adding another LB is not quite feasible.. But if you say that you can do it if everyone wants it.. so can we have a vote in relation to this?

You can see alternative ranking on gametracker